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Part VIII : Osho’s interaction with reporters
Osho keeps the air-conditioned room at 60F. Interviewers agree
to take anti-allergy precautions
I must be a little bit in love with you, because I didn't smoke
all day. I didn't drink. I had all my clothes dry-cleaned. And
I have cold feet—just to see you and to hear you saying
what you want to say.
I know you must be in love with me. And you can see in my eyes
and see my love for you. That's why I am saying, take a few grapes.
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How do you stay warm in such a cold room?
It is not cold.
To me it is very cold.
To me it is only cool.
You feel better in cold surroundings such as this? Have you always,
even as a child?
Always last130
I was just talking to one journalist, and I was saying to him
that you should not depend on machines. And now the whole war
game is not between man and man—that is out of date—the
whole war game is between technological nuclear weapons. Even
the missiles which will carry the weapons will not have any pilots
with them, there is no need. The missile itself can be programmed
where to go, where to drop the bomb.
I was saying to him that man has become so dependent on technological
machines that anything can go wrong any moment. And when I said
this, the electricity went off! The journalist had nothing to
say anymore. The proof was there! I said, "Now we can move
onto another subject. This is finished." dless04
You are a very funny Master. Why do I keep getting the feeling
that You are playing a joke on everyone and, if You are, how would
I know?
That is the funniest part of it. A joke can never be explained.
Either you get it or you don't get it.
That's the beauty of a joke.
Everything is a joke, because to me life is not a serious affair.
It is playfulness. It is fun. It is overflowing energy of existence—for
no reason, for no purpose. For no goal, for no end. Just for the
sheer joy of it. This whole universe is just a big joke. That's
why it cannot be explained.
There have been so many philosophers, theologians, trying to explain
it. They have all failed for the simple reason because it is not
something that can be explained. Either you get it or you don't
get it. last327
You have just to see my bathroom. Perhaps it is the best in the
whole world.
Is that an invitation?
Yes.
I've never been invited to the bathroom before. I've been told
I belonged in the bathroom before, but never invited to one.
I am a rare and a unique person in every way: I invite you into
my bathroom!
That is unique. But where do we go from there?
There is nowhere to go. Enjoy the jacuzzi there, enjoy the shower
there, enjoy the hot shower, enjoy the ice-cold shower….
And then get out…I understand! I need to know this for my
own edification: have You ever invited a member of the press to
Your bathroom before?
No…
Thank You. I think that's important.
…because I never liked any man the way I like you.
I wonder if this could be love?
This is!
Invited to the bathroom…. Well, I'm sure the listeners of
this program are thinking You and I are going to start a nightclub
act. last118
Just the other night, one beautiful girl was taking my interview
for television. And you know I am mad…. She asked me—now,
she was not aware what kind of man I am; she must have taken hundreds
of interviews of politicians, priests, and all kind of dodos—she
asked me, "You have loved so many women, but don't you have
a stable relationship with one woman?"
I said, "That is impossible. I don't have any relationship—stable
or unstable. I live in the moment."
She said, "At this time, who is the woman?"
I said, "You are the woman! I love you in this moment."
And in the end, when I started singing and dancing with my sannyasins,
I called her close to me: "Hold my hand and dance with me."
And it was such a beautiful situation.
She told my secretary, "Now my boyfriend is going to freak
out!" I have just said, "I love you," and was just
holding her hand and just dancing with my people—why should
her boyfriend freak out? And if he's a freaker, let him freak
out. He's not worthy of being a boyfriend. Drop that worthless
creature! Come to my commune where nobody freaks out, everybody
freaks in. false28
One beautiful woman journalist was just asking me, "I have
heard you don't have dreams."
I said, "Certainly, I don't have dreams. For example, I love
you. You can be my girlfriend."
She was shocked! She could not believe it! She enjoyed it too.
She said, "But why are you saying it?"
I said, "That's why I don't have any dreams. It came to me
to say it, so I said it; it is finished. You need not trouble
yourself to come into my dream. But if I don't say it to you now,
then you would have to come into my dream, and then I would say
it to you.
"It is simply finished. I have said it, you have heard, you
have enjoyed. You have giggled. You will never have such an interview
again in your whole life! I just do the thing that I want to do,
without thinking of any consequences. That's why I don't have
dreams. Do you want to question me more about it?"
She said, "No!"—because this man seems to be crazy.
He may start making love to me, right now, here, before the television
camera! If he can say it, he can do it too! It is better to change
the subject. dless29
Just the other night, I was talking to a very beautiful heart,
a Dutch journalist—which is rare, because journalism is
worse than politics….
His question was relevant. He was puzzled: "There are people
who have been with you for twenty, thirty years—can't they
see these many contradictions? And they go on believing in you?"
He was simply using the word "belief" wrongly.
My people trust me, love me. It is not a question of my statements
to them. They enjoy my statements, it is good entertainment, but
it is not a belief system for which you have to live and die.
It is only pure entertainment. You have just to laugh and enjoy.
My real work is going on underground. Whatever I am doing is just
creating a situation so your head is engaged. And my real approach,
my target, is your heart, not your skull. And it is the best way
I have found to sort out people. Those who approach me rationally
will soon find the way towards Santa Fe*. Santa Fe is going to
be a world-famous place. All the camels of different sizes and
shapes!
To be with me you have to learn one art, and that is, don't take
my statements seriously. For the moment enjoy them, but don't
expect that I am not going to contradict them. Don't impose any
expectations of yours on me. I never impose any expectations on
you. At least this much you can do—a simple thing.
For centuries masters have been imposing their ideas on the disciples.
I am not imposing any of my ideas on you. Don't from your side
insist on how I should behave, what I should say or not say; accept
that saying something will create contradiction, saying it will
create hostility in people outside, saying it will create unnecessary
confusion. Don't expect anything from me. Open your heart. That
is where the real surgery has to happen.
And once you have known the beauty, the joy, the blessing of dancing
in tune with my heart, you will never be bothered by what I said
yesterday, what I said ten years ago. Leave all this to people
whose profession is gravedigging. Let them settle with the skeletons
of the past.
You be here now in this moment, part of my life, part of my love,
part of my being. Let me reach you in your innermost core. Allow
me to touch your center.
The head is only the periphery, and I am not interested in your
heads. I don't count heads, I count the hearts.
The Dutch journalist could understand. When I stood up and started
dancing with the sannyasins, he was dancing behind me—in
absolute abandon, as if nothing else existed in that moment but
the dance.
I told the man, "You can write anything you want about me.
Even if you want to say things which I have not said, I give you
the authority, because I have been able to touch your heart. And
beware, soon you will be a sannyasin!"
I could see the glow in his eyes—just the idea of being
a sannyasin, a great adventure ahead, a great pilgrimage. And
the way he was dancing was absolutely drunk. It is just coincidence
that he happens to be a journalist, that is not his place. His
place is amongst the sannyasins, he is a seeker. And he trusts
me….
When I was talking to the Dutch journalist, he was worried. He
loves me, he has been here before at celebrations, he has been
reading my books. He himself has paid his fare, because the editor
was not ready to pay the fare. The editor is ready to publish
whatsoever the journalist writes, but he was not ready to pay
the fare from Holland to here. The journalist has paid it himself.
*Note: Santa Fe, New Mexico: a few sannyasins left the ranch are
living in Santa Fe. Osho refers to them as 'camels' after a Sufi
story about the camel, lion and child. dless03
Just a few days ago, I was talking to a very intelligent and
loving Swiss journalist. As I looked into his eyes, I told him,
"Though I am not an astrologer or a prophet, about you I
cannot resist the temptation of making a prophecy."
He said, "What prophecy?"
I said, "You are so intelligent and so loving, you cannot
remain long without becoming a sannyasin."
And the next day he became a sannyasin! He did not wait even for
a few days.
I recognize my people immediately—just a look into their
eyes and I know they belong to me. And to belong to me does not
mean to fit with me or with anything or anybody.
To belong to me means to belong to freedom, to belong to your
individuality, to belong to your purity, your naturalness….
dless38
You know I have to thank you. About a year and a half ago, I
had a really dark time in my life…I tried your laughter
meditation and the whole day went completely different than before.
So I need to thank you for showing me this meditation.
Just one meditation has done that much for you. If you try a few
others you will not find words to thank me.
I have one hundred and twelve methods of meditation. If a person
can manage even ten out of those, his life will be a sheer joy
with no dark moments, with no frustration, with no tension, no
anxiety. Whatsoever happens, he will be able to accept it without
any grudge, without any complaint. His gratitude towards existence
will be infinite.
We are very ungrateful to existence. It has given so much to us,
and without our asking. And we are such ungrateful creatures that
we don't even bother to look around at what existence is continuously
doing for us—the sun, the moon, the stars, the trees, the
birds, the animals, the people. You are living in a tremendously
beautiful dream. But you have to be awake about it—only
then a gratefulness arises. I call that gratefulness true religion.
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When I came out of simple curiosity to the ranch in May, it never
occurred to me that I might be sitting here having your full attention.
I had dreamed of such a thing perhaps, but I find the moment quite
moving.
I know. I can feel your heart and your tears. So there is a possibility
of authentic communion. You are no more a journalist; I can talk
to you now heart to heart. Otherwise, journalism is something
superficial. The moment it becomes a communion of the heart….
But if it is heart to heart, then journalism can also become art
and literature. And it should become. last224
I would like to ask you to tell me as precisely and concisely
as possible the essence of your teachings…
You want to know what is my teaching. It is very simple. The essential
core of my teaching is: no belief, no dogma, no creed, no religion,
nothing borrowed. But only that which you have experienced has
to be trusted; everything else has to be doubted. Just as other
religions have their foundation in belief, I have my foundation
in doubt. My foundation is exactly what the foundation science
has: doubt until you find something indubitable, experiential.
Science moves outwards; I move inwards. This inward movement I
call meditation. You have to take three simple steps for this
inward movement, and the fourth happens on its own accord.
The first step is observing all your activities; that is your
body and its acts—walking, chopping wood, drawing water
from the well. Remain a witness. Don't do it like a robot.
May I interrupt?
No. No interruption.
Second, when you have become capable of watching and witnessing
your body and its activities, then you can take the second step:
watch the activities of your mind—thoughts, dreams, imagination.
Just remain a witness, as if you are standing by the side of the
road and a procession of thoughts is passing on the road. You
are not part of it. You are just a mirror reflecting, without
any judgment—because mirror has no judgment. A beautiful
face, the mirror does not say, "Great." A ugly face,
the mirror does not say, "My God." The mirror simply
reflects whatsoever comes before it. Exactly one has to become
a pure witness, without any judgment, evaluation, good, bad. Then
a strange experience happens: as your witnessing grows, thoughts
start lessening. In the same proportion, if you have ten percent
witnessing, then there are ninety percent thoughts; if you have
ninety percent of consciousness, awareness, then there are only
ten percent thoughts. Hundred percent witness, and there is just
pure nothingness; this is the state of no-mind, this is the door
to the third and the last step.
Now watch subtle emotions, moods. Thoughts are not so subtle.
Moods, a certain shadow of sadness, a certain joy.
One is concerned with the body, the second with the mind, the
third with the heart. And when you become capable of watching
the third too, the fourth happens on its own accord. Suddenly
a quantum leap and you are standing exactly at the very center
of your being, where there is nothing to be aware of. Awareness
is aware of itself, consciousness if conscious of itself. And
this is the moment of ultimate ecstasy, samadhi, enlightenment,
or whatever name one prefers to give it; but this is the ultimate,
there is nothing above it. There is no way to go beyond it, because
wherever you go beyond it you will still be a witness. If you
start witnessing the witness, you have not gone above it; you
are still a witness. So witness is the very end of the inner journey,
you have come home.
And this is my whole teaching. It is absolutely scientific. It
needs no belief, it needs only experimentation. And I don't ask
anybody to trust me. I ask only to experiment and experience.
I know that it will happen to you because it has happened to me,
and I am just as ordinary a human being as you are. I don't claim
to be a prophet or a savior or an incarnation of God. I don't
claim any speciality. I am just exactly like you. The only difference
is you are still asleep, and I am awake. It is only a question,
sooner or later you will be awake too.
So there is no need to worship me, there is no need to adore me.
If you really love me, that's enough for you to move into the
experiment. I will stand a guarantee: that it happens. I will
be your encouragement, but I will not be your savior. I will not
take the responsibility, but I will do my best to shake you and
wake you up.
Can I interrupt now?
Yes, now you can. last302
I feel that I'm in a mystery school now….
Here is every possibility to inquire into your self. It is not
an ideology that I preach, it is not a religion that I impose.
On the contrary, my whole effort is to deprogram you. So that
you become again an innocent child the way you had come into the
world, without any prejudice, without any idea, just innocent.
And once that innocence is there, existence opens all its mysteries
to you.
So be here for few days, or whenever you can come, come here and
remain here for a few days. Mix with my people, who are all seekers,
who are all meditators, who are doing things that they wanted
to do, and who are rejoicing life in its totality. Just being
with them, the very aroma, the milieu, the atmosphere, something
may catch fire in you. It always happens.
You have read my words, but words are dead. You have to read me,
and to read me there is only one way: to be here for some time,
and to sit silently and just let your presence and my presence
melt and merge. They have their own way, their own language, which
is beyond mind; but once you understand that in silence, in somebody's
presence, something blossoms in you, starts growing in you, then
you have found a friend on the path.
I'm not a saviour, I'm not a prophet. I'm just a friend. And anybody
who wants to walk few steps with me on the path is welcome, and
whenever he wants to depart he's absolutely free. There is no
bondage, no condition. It is an unconditional togetherness.
My whole commune is not any organization. It is just pure togetherness
without any conditions from any side. Anybody can join it, anybody
can move out of it. Everybody is totally free to have his own
way.
But being with five thousand seekers immensely helps. Alone the
path is really very lonely, alone it is very dark, alone there
are many moments when one is discouraged. With other seekers ahead
of you, behind of you, by the side of you, you know there is no
fear. People have passed this stage. There come nights—dark
nights of the soul, but you know that others have passed through
these dark nights, they have reached; and seeing the sunrise,
there is no reason it cannot happen to you. It has to happen to
you because you have as much right, just by being alive and being
part of existence, as anybody else. Nobody is special in existence,
everybody is just with the same right.
The differences are created because few people use their right
and few people don't use their right. last328
People who come just as spectators cannot believe it. The journalists
cannot believe that people can be so happy, so joyful; they think
that you are putting it on. And I cannot say that journalists
are misrepresenting it knowingly. They have seen the whole world;
there is no joy anywhere. How can they believe that so many people
can be joyous, and for nothing, because what have we got?
One journalist, a woman from Newsweek, was here. She told Sheela,
"This is all a put-up business—these people are just
pretending." Sheela told me…so I sent a message to
the woman, "You remain here for seven days. For seven days,
twenty-four hours a day, people cannot continue a put-up business.
And these people are working twelve hours, fourteen hours a day,
seven days a week. You try!—work fourteen hours a day, seven
days a week, then pretend…. If you can do that, then you
can write about how this is a put-up job."
The woman understood that this was true. Seven days she stayed;
of course she did not work, but she said, "I can understand
that working fourteen hours—it is impossible to pretend."
Seven days she stayed, and she apologized; but she said to Sheela,
"Now what I am writing my bosses are not going to accept.
They will say, 'You are hypnotized.'"
She left, and that's what happened: the bosses said, "You
should not have stayed there that long. That man played a trick
upon you. He challenged you to remain seven days, and hypnotized
you."
But she said, "He has not even seen me, we have not met."
But the boss said, "Your article is proof enough that you
are hypnotized: not a single negative statement in it, no criticism.
I cannot publish this article. You will have to change it."
The magazine is owned by a Christian association. The woman had
to change it and write things which she knew were wrong.
This is a strange world. People are miserable, misery has become
their natural quality. Here, once in a while, somebody becomes
miserable; there, once in a while, somebody smiles. But that is
a great difference….
The woman from Newsweek was very disturbed because whatsoever
she had seen in seven days, she had written. She called from New
York, "When Sheela comes this way, my boss will be in Chicago
and I will be in Chicago. If Sheela passes by and can spare one
day—because I am in difficulty. My boss simply thinks that
I need to be deprogramed. So if Sheela meets him it would be good."
I said to Sheela, "It will be good: meet him and try to hypnotize
him—see what you can do." And what actually happened?
The boss wouldn't look at Sheela. He didn't give himself any chance
to be hypnotized; he would look sideways, here and there, but
not towards Sheela. person25
I told the Australian media, "Get ready, I am coming,"
now the whole of Australia is agog, afraid. Newspapers have started
coming, saying that people are very much disturbed, afraid that
I may remain there, may not leave Australia. But the man himself
who was here was an intelligent man. I really loved the man, he
was not just a journalist.
He is answering the phone calls continuously coming to his studio.
He informed us, "I have never answered myself, my secretary
answers, but this time I am answering myself because I can say
to them that I have been there, I have seen the man, I have seen
the commune that is there, and they are beautiful people, and
you need not be afraid. And don't get unnecessarily excited by
rumors. There is no danger." But it is now all over Australia,
a great wave of fear. I have not gone there and there is not much
possibility.
But my people are there, and my people are growing in every country.
And in every country my people will have to face the same problems.
They cannot believe, the politicians and others, that I am not
going to use my influence politically. It is something inconceivable
to those retarded people, that there can be a man who has great
influence and is not going to use it in any way.
My influence is that of love. I love my people, and I would not
like to put my people in any kind of destructive situation. last110
Do you feel the way the press report you is fair?
It is almost fair. It cannot be absolutely fair for the simple
reason because journalism has not raised itself into an art. It
serves the retarded masses, and depends on sensationalism. It
is criminal. That's why I say 'almost fair'. last303
Most of the journalists have been very fair, very loving, and
those are the only people I have come in contact with from the
outside world. They have been intelligent and they could understand
what I am saying and they could understand the sense of humor.
All the journalists who have come here, except one or two, have
enjoyed the place, loved the place, wanted to come again and again.
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